By Alex Ward@AlexWardVoxalex.ward@vox.com Apr 28, 2020

Sweden is actually faring worse than other Scandinavian nations and even worse than the United States, which has the highest number of confirmed total cases in the world. (It’s important to note that other nations — such as Spain and Italy — not included in the chart have higher death rates per million people than Sweden...

Following the advice of the country’s chief epidemiologist, Anders Tegnell, the Swedish government chose not to impose strict lockdowns, curfews, or major border closings because the government felt it would hurt the economy and would only push the crisis further down the road...

[When we compare] rates of coronavirus deaths per 1 million people...

Sweden is actually faring worse than other Scandinavian nations and even worse than the United States.

Where Sweden does compare favorably to the US is the country’s death rate when compared to New York City’s (not the whole US)...

But there are three main reasons why the Big Apple would be worse off than the entire country of Sweden, experts say.

The first is population density: New York City has more than 38,000 people per square kilometer, while Sweden has just 25 people — meaning it’s harder to socially distance in New York.

Second, some hospitals in New York City were overwhelmed while Sweden still has about 250 hospital beds unoccupied...

Finally, there is significantly more international travel to New York City than there is to Sweden

But when zooming out, it’s clear that Sweden as a whole is worse off than the US as a whole. That could, of course, change down the line, but any current arguments that Sweden got its outbreak response right are premature at best and dangerous at worst.

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There is little I can add to this. Because many people - including me - want to believe that we can go back to some semblance of normality does not mean that we can, without suffering a much higher death rate. We should also consider that our hospitals are stretched to the breaking point all ready. It is difficult to buy any kind of face mask, and particularly difficult to buy the N95 face masks that offer the most protection.

 

I had someone on Facebook post that Sweden was doing so much better than the US and that they were past the crisis. She then posted an article that essentially said the exact opposite of what she said.

 

That is what the will to believe can do. Frequently what we want to believe is not true.

 

Belgium in particular has an extremely high death rate from this virus. And it has some of the tightest quarantine procedures in place. The same can be said for Italy and Spain. I know that we all feel helpless in this onslaught of this media created panic and want to find the magic bullet to solve it and we’ve been sold on quarantine. Swedish scientists and I disagree. More and more terrifying economic data is emerging on the lasting damage of these lockdowns. Sweden will not allow it’s economy to suffer the same fate. Good for Sweden.

Several states are reopening in the US and we will soon see that there will not be a deadly spike in new cases because this virus has been so ubiquitous in the general population that people are ready for it.

Same here in the Netherlands.

I think the lockdown may have only made people less prepared.

And for those that say the lockdown was worth it to save a few lives... The lives saved cannot be proven and if you expect just to go back to work you may find that your job might be gone forever and you might have great difficulty finding another

 

It's fantastic how Sweden has gone from "rape-capital with no-go zones because of all them MOOSLIMS" to a right-winger's Corona wet dream.

Also the best way to ensure a huge death toll.

 

All what

 

Statistical analysis and comparative studies into the responses of different countries don't exist. The world is a big mystery.

So, in your estimation, how many human lives can we comfortably sacrifice so the economy doesn't suffer?

 

The terrifying news is the That US economy hasn’t had quarter this bad since 2008.

 

Yes and some are saying things haven’t been this bad since the Great Depression.

The difference between this and 2008 and 1929 is that this one is self inflicted.

 

I was exposed to no less than 3 flus as a child. Some fevers ranging as high as 40 C or 104 F. Never mind the other gory details.

I have never had a flu as an adult even though they were going around.

I don’t think that is a coincidence.

 

1929: Unregulated stock exchange excess leads to a huge stock market crash, pulling the world economy with it.

2008: Unregulated subprime lending leads to a huge economic collapse, pulling the world economy with it.

2020: A new virus emerges and causes a global pandemic, causing the world economy to grind to a halt. And this is the one that's supposed to be self-inflicted?

 

Covid-19 is not a flu.

 

Will we ever be free of it though? There's no cure for ordinary colds. You don't get immunity from colds however many you get. There are several well-known coronaviruses that we are exposed to regularly and have been circulating in the human population for centuries. These viruses cause common colds.

 

If each life “presumed” saved by a method not yet definitively proven to save lives (i.e. quarantine) costs millions each, is it worth it?

If the same presumption is in place is it worth the present unemployment rate?

Remember that in 1929 especially and 2008 many people were not going to work because the jobs weren’t available. In this instance, they are forbidden to go to work!

That’s a difference worth noting.

The causes of the Great Depression are still in debate in academic circles but none of the noted economists are blaming stay at home orders.

2oo8 was also not due to government action.

Same can be said about the recessions in the late 19th century, the immediate recession after world war 2, and the recession in the 70’s and early 80’s and then late 80’s or others not listed here.

All brought about by economic situations and not one brought about by what is effectively government house arrest.

I wish that the constitutionally of this were challenged by SCOTUS.

 

Yes and this is why we need to test and strengthen our immune systems rather than locking them away from potential dangers.

I fear people think that every problem can be solved by increasingly intense legislation. Or by science.

“I finally figured out that not every crisis can be managed. As much as we want to keep ourselves safe, we can't protect ourselves from everything. If we want to embrace life, we also have to embrace chaos.”

Susan Elizabeth Philips

 

Absolutely. Are you saying that human lives aren't worth millions?

Absolutely. The unemployment rate can be mitigated with welfare programs. Dead is dead.

No, they're not.

Sure it was.

 

It is anecdotal.....i thought you said you had scientific training?

Thinskin